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Ray Lawrence - 25/Jul/07 05:29 AM
Agree with this, however, we need to be careful who can be specified. Increasingly the person with the key is not a "teacher" but someone in an administrative role. There may eve be more than one contact. An interface like the one where individuals are assigned to roles would be ideal to specify the key holder. Dropping the message would be a significant backward step IMHO, even with the frustrations recorded here.
Yes, that's *exactly* the problem we have. The contact role is an administrator which is down the "pecking order" on the roles list. The current situation is that some professor gets named which is actually turning into something of a political problem. I wouldn't want to take it out either ideally.
I don't mind doing the work to sort this out, but I'm really not sure what the interface would look like (or where it would be). I'm hoping for inspiration for that "really clever" solution :-)
What bout the interface in groups for selecting people. It's familiar and is hidden away until needed. Hmmm... for ultimate flexibility how about the message in Users > Authentication? This has default text if left empty but will display whatever alternative is entered..... This would help if the admin person does not have an account on the site too.
I suspect that most people will want the named person to actually be a "teacher" on the course - the alternative is probably lots of boxes for a minor function. I guess a dropdown under the enrolment key to select the person (in course settings) would do the job. Would need to think about what happens if you then remove that person from the course - but at least you would be able to change it!
I have to disagree with this, I'm afraid (and doesn't it contradict your comments at 04.19?). Limiting a list of candidates to a list of those in a "teacher" role will negate the opportunity to select someone who has an administrative role for the site and is not necessarily directly involved in the courses. Linking this to accounts in some way assigned to a role in a specific course would be a bad thing IMHO, not least for the reason in above i.e when a person is removed from a course.
Sorry, I actually meant "not a student". I'm just concerned that you end up with a select box for people who are registered in the site and an edit box(es) for those who are not. I don't think that it's unreasonable that the person should at least be authenticated on the Moodle site and I don't really see why they wouldn't have some rights over the course even if assigned at some higher level with limited rights. Tricky!
Np. personally, I think that for the "key contact" to have an account on the site is a reasonable requirement. I was in blue sky mode above. Whatever additional capabilities they need can be address in the normal way.
I still thing the opportunity to be able to select more than one person would be good... Just use a list box then, so that multiple names can be control-clicked.
Sounds like a plan....
(as we're in conversation I'm reminded of a couple of question export things which I've been meaning to log.... watch you inbox... :0)) Hi Howard and Ray,
A possible solution (thanks to Yu!) is to create a role called Key holder with only course:update allowed then use the up arrows to move it above the teacher role in Administration > Users > Permissions > Define roles. A teacher can then be assigned this role in the course context. Thanks Helen,
Good workaround, sounds like an FAQ entry :-) Meant to add....
...the problem is that what we have is something like Course Director, Lecturer, Lecturer, Course adminstrator and "politically" the course administrator has to go at the bottom of the list but in order to be the contact name for the key they actually need to be at the top. Calling this role something more neutral *may* help, but I can still see complaints that the Director is not at the top. Nowt so strange as Folk, etc. Mmm... possible flash of inspiration:
What about if we add an option in the Course Settings to specify the *role* of the keyholder. This means that the poor secretary role (or indeed Keyholder role) can sit at the bottom of the list yet be picked up as the keyholder. This would also allow more than one to be listed as long as they are assigned to the appropriate role. Thanks Helen, that's a useful short term workaround. Even setting aside the political sensitivities, I think a Howard's earlier proposals need implementing. I think that not having to use roles for this would be a good thing in general, as it's a notification mechanism only.......
Ray,
What do you think about my previous comment in about specifying the role. It could actually be done as a simple addition to the Administration=>Appearance=>Course Managers page sitewide with the distinct advantages of being a config setting (hence no database changes). Sorted - there is now an option to specify the role in the manual enrolment plugins. If, in a course, users are assigned to that role they will be displayed as the contact names for the enrolment key. If there are non assigned or the setting is unset the enrolment page reverts to the original behavious (first person with update rights)
Not seeing this yet from CVS ... but do you think there is a case for this being located in the site Admin menu a la Course Managers. Or is this database related?
It was there (I can't read). Works as advertised. Great work! Many thanks.
I found this thread eventually... but still can't get it to work. I've set up a user (support) with only the role "Support". This role only has permission to update courses. I've set the manual enrolment plugin to look for this role. I've even put that role at the top of the site roles list. But, still, I see my name on the enrolment key page (I've got admin rights).
The even more confusing thing is that the welcome email that comes out when a learner enrols has another administrator's name in the from field...? How do I get the Support user's email address put in the from field of the welcome email? Hi Mark,
I assume from your forum posting http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=96614 that you've managed to get the keyholder to appear on the enrolment key page. Is the from address of the welcome email working fine too? Hi Helen,
Yes, I've got the keyholder on the enrolment key page, and, as long as you've manually added the keyholder to the support role for each course then the welcome emails come from the right place. Thanks, Mark |
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Bug
Resolved
Major
Very difficult to control who is the teacher named on the 'you need an enrolment key from' page.