Moodle

Grader report: column averages and category aggregates should be based on what the current user can see

Details

  • Type: Sub-task Sub-task
  • Status: Closed Closed
  • Priority: Blocker Blocker
  • Resolution: Fixed
  • Affects Version/s: 1.9
  • Fix Version/s: 1.9
  • Component/s: Gradebook
  • Labels:
    None
  • Affected Branches:
    MOODLE_19_STABLE
  • Fixed Branches:
    MOODLE_19_STABLE

Description

I've moved this in here so that all OU outstanding issues are in one place. This is the one remaining MAJOR issue for us.

We've read 11576 but I can interpret the outcome in more than one way.

Also I talked to Martin on 5/10/07 about this and Martin said in an email to me on 5/10/07
"We've been talking it through and working out how to create averages of all non-hidden, non-zero items (for those who can't see hidden items) for both rows (aggregate of categories) and columns (aggregate of users for an item). I agree this is much better (for all).

It's a bit tricky, but we're going to give it a shot, so watch the tracker."

I've been watching the tracker but haven't seen anything specific to this item so I'm placing it here today 11/10/07. (And my apologies if I have missed it or if I should have gone back to 11576)

The issue is what to do about hidden grades when calculating averages. The problem is that some averages still (on 11/10/07) inadvertantly enable hidden grades to be deduced.

Screenshot-1 shows a tutor view. Claire Simpson has one hidden grade under iCMA47 which is in the Summative category. The entry under iCMA47 is correctly shown as a date but the entry under the Category total (titled 'average' in the screenshot) enables the tutor to calculate that she actually got 20%.

Now look at Susan Pearson's row. Again the Category total for the Summative category enables a calculation to be carried out that reveals what Susan's score on iCMA47 is.

So what do we do about this?

My preferred outcome would be that Category totals are calculated purely on what is visible on-screen. So for Claire Simpson the entry under the Summative Category total ( titled ' average') would become '-' because there are no scores to average; and for Susan Pearson the Summative Category total would be 52% (i.e.52/1).

The Course total would have to be calculated in a similar manner.

Similar calculations apply in the OU USER report and in the various other reports we have where the readers cannot view hidden grades.

I understand from what Martin said that this could be tricky. If it is then we have to revert to the fall-back position of showing '-' in Category and Course totals where there are hidden grades.

Issue Links

Activity

Hide
Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

I actually thought this was done and dusted. I'm following up now.

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Martin Dougiamas added a comment - I actually thought this was done and dusted. I'm following up now.
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment -

Having the grades dependent on who views the report is definitely not good:
1/ it is slow - new gradebook was supposed to be fast (we need this for conditional activities)
2/ export expects only one properly defined grade that is not changing
3/ other parts might break

Proper solution is IMO to change the way aggregation works and allow aggregation with/without the hidden grades depending on category setting. See new linked bug.

I have committed a workaround for 1.9.x, the totals are recalculated on the fly if needed.
There is also a new setting to show date or '-' instead of hidden grades - the problem with dates is that we would have to dig in history table to get proper date, the timemodified is not directly related to modification of grade value.

Please reopen if there are any problems.

Thanks for the report

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - Having the grades dependent on who views the report is definitely not good: 1/ it is slow - new gradebook was supposed to be fast (we need this for conditional activities) 2/ export expects only one properly defined grade that is not changing 3/ other parts might break Proper solution is IMO to change the way aggregation works and allow aggregation with/without the hidden grades depending on category setting. See new linked bug. I have committed a workaround for 1.9.x, the totals are recalculated on the fly if needed. There is also a new setting to show date or '-' instead of hidden grades - the problem with dates is that we would have to dig in history table to get proper date, the timemodified is not directly related to modification of grade value. Please reopen if there are any problems. Thanks for the report
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - - edited

Please not the following limitations:

  • calculation formulas depending on hidden or altered values are shown as '', any item depending on these formulas is also ''.
  • the altered totals are shown only on User and Grader report (not OU user report yet)
Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - - edited Please not the following limitations:
  • calculation formulas depending on hidden or altered values are shown as '', any item depending on these formulas is also ''.
  • the altered totals are shown only on User and Grader report (not OU user report yet)
Hide
Philip Butcher added a comment -

In conversation with Martin I indicated that in this area we would need to balance our requests against what is possible and that we would willing to take advice on issues that may impact on performance. Items 1, 2 and 3 above sound like things we need to take into account.

I will look at what has been done today and already have a face-to-face meeting arranged with Martin on Monday. Tim tells me that Petr will be in Milton Keynes also next week. Could Petr and I meet to talk this through?

Show
Philip Butcher added a comment - In conversation with Martin I indicated that in this area we would need to balance our requests against what is possible and that we would willing to take advice on issues that may impact on performance. Items 1, 2 and 3 above sound like things we need to take into account. I will look at what has been done today and already have a face-to-face meeting arranged with Martin on Monday. Tim tells me that Petr will be in Milton Keynes also next week. Could Petr and I meet to talk this through?
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment -

I am coming to MK later on Monday, it would be nice to meet you and talk about remaining issues.

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - I am coming to MK later on Monday, it would be nice to meet you and talk about remaining issues.
Hide
Philip Butcher added a comment -

Good. As you're coming all this way I'll fall in with your timetable though I'd rather do this before the Moodle Moot rather than during or after.

So I'm free all day on Tuesday. Might you have an hour free? If not then perhaps early evening on Monday or Tuesday.

Show
Philip Butcher added a comment - Good. As you're coming all this way I'll fall in with your timetable though I'd rather do this before the Moodle Moot rather than during or after. So I'm free all day on Tuesday. Might you have an hour free? If not then perhaps early evening on Monday or Tuesday.
Hide
Philip Butcher added a comment -

I've now had a look and everything looks good apart from one thing.

I have set Category totals and Course total to appear as percentages and they do appear as percentages if there are no hidden grades. However if there are hidden grades, although the calculation correctly omits these, the resulting Category and Course totals are shown as the 'real' value but with the '%' symbol. See screenshot 2.

Show
Philip Butcher added a comment - I've now had a look and everything looks good apart from one thing. I have set Category totals and Course total to appear as percentages and they do appear as percentages if there are no hidden grades. However if there are hidden grades, although the calculation correctly omits these, the resulting Category and Course totals are shown as the 'real' value but with the '%' symbol. See screenshot 2.
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment -

thanks for testing, I will look at it..

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - thanks for testing, I will look at it..
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment -

the bug causing trouble in screenshot 2 should be fixed now

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - the bug causing trouble in screenshot 2 should be fixed now
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - - edited

Reopening - the altered aggregation for student grades breaks the SQL calculation of column totals on grader report. This can not be fixed easily because we would have to replace the SQL totals calculation with full recalculation of all grades (which means load everything into memory, do the maths and calculate the columns totals from the altered values). Please note that we can not even tell whether the total is affected by hiding or not

Solutions:
1/ implement hiding db changes and change aggregation logic and store the aggregates without the hidden grades in db if required + undo the last patches (this would require db changes and new settings)
2/ always show hidden grades on grader report, keep the altered ones on user report
3/ add switch to do the complete (and incredibly slow) in-memory calculation (this would require a lot more hacking in the grader report)

I do not think there is an easy way to solve this...

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - - edited Reopening - the altered aggregation for student grades breaks the SQL calculation of column totals on grader report. This can not be fixed easily because we would have to replace the SQL totals calculation with full recalculation of all grades (which means load everything into memory, do the maths and calculate the columns totals from the altered values). Please note that we can not even tell whether the total is affected by hiding or not Solutions: 1/ implement hiding db changes and change aggregation logic and store the aggregates without the hidden grades in db if required + undo the last patches (this would require db changes and new settings) 2/ always show hidden grades on grader report, keep the altered ones on user report 3/ add switch to do the complete (and incredibly slow) in-memory calculation (this would require a lot more hacking in the grader report) I do not think there is an easy way to solve this...
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - - edited

Fixed altered aggregation for overriden and locked grades.

The rank is calculated using SQL too -> it is broken too now, it can be disabled in user report settings

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - - edited Fixed altered aggregation for overriden and locked grades. The rank is calculated using SQL too -> it is broken too now, it can be disabled in user report settings
Hide
Philip Butcher added a comment -

I've just talked this through with Martin who has indicated to me where the isues are. I'll go and think about these now. We've agreed to meet tomorrow (Tuesday 23rd October) at 9.00 am in the OU Main reception in the Berrill Building (see map at http://www3.open.ac.uk/contact/maps/wh-campus.gif). We're hoping that you can join us.

Show
Philip Butcher added a comment - I've just talked this through with Martin who has indicated to me where the isues are. I'll go and think about these now. We've agreed to meet tomorrow (Tuesday 23rd October) at 9.00 am in the OU Main reception in the Berrill Building (see map at http://www3.open.ac.uk/contact/maps/wh-campus.gif). We're hoping that you can join us.
Hide
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment -

Should be mostly fixed now, some totals or ranks may not be displaying correct values if user does not have view hidden and hidde ngrades are present,
this can be fixed properly in 2.0

Show
Petr Škoda (skodak) added a comment - Should be mostly fixed now, some totals or ranks may not be displaying correct values if user does not have view hidden and hidde ngrades are present, this can be fixed properly in 2.0

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    Updated:
    Resolved: