Moodle
  1. Moodle
  2. MDL-31509

Outcomes panel does not show in editing quiz settings

    Details

    • Testing Instructions:
      Hide

      1. Make sure outcomes are enable under Admin -> Advanced features.

      2. In your test course, make sure there is at least one scale available. (Scales are in the gradebook settings. You should have the connected and separate ways of learning scale by default.)

      3. Also in the gradebook settings, go to Edit outcomes. Add an outcome like "Learning style" using the scale.

      4. Add or edit a quiz. In the quiz settings, select your outcome.

      5. Go back to the grade book. The quiz should have two columns, one for the grade and one for the outcome.

      6. Attempt the quiz as a student. The grade should automatically go into the gradebook, but the only way to fill in the outcome is for the teacher to turn editing on in the gradebook and set it manually.

      Show
      1. Make sure outcomes are enable under Admin -> Advanced features. 2. In your test course, make sure there is at least one scale available. (Scales are in the gradebook settings. You should have the connected and separate ways of learning scale by default.) 3. Also in the gradebook settings, go to Edit outcomes. Add an outcome like "Learning style" using the scale. 4. Add or edit a quiz. In the quiz settings, select your outcome. 5. Go back to the grade book. The quiz should have two columns, one for the grade and one for the outcome. 6. Attempt the quiz as a student. The grade should automatically go into the gradebook, but the only way to fill in the outcome is for the teacher to turn editing on in the gradebook and set it manually.
    • Workaround:
      Hide

      The workaround is to create an outcome item in the Grader report area and associate it with the quiz, but this is cumbersome when you need to add multiple outcomes to multiple quizzes.

      Show
      The workaround is to create an outcome item in the Grader report area and associate it with the quiz, but this is cumbersome when you need to add multiple outcomes to multiple quizzes.
    • Affected Branches:
      MOODLE_20_STABLE, MOODLE_21_STABLE, MOODLE_22_STABLE
    • Fixed Branches:
      MOODLE_22_STABLE, MOODLE_23_STABLE
    • Pull from Repository:
    • Pull Master Branch:
    • Rank:
      38052

      Description

      In Moodle 1.9, Outcomes were available to be added to/associated with a quiz from the Edit quiz settings area. From 2.0 onwards, this panel seems to be gone, even with outcomes enabled and added to the course. I'm guessing its fallen off accidentally, but it is really useful to have when adding multiple outcomes to multiple quizzes.

        Activity

        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        Are you sure about this? I don't remember the quiz ever working like this. Is it possible that your Moodle 1.9 site had been customised by someone?

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - Are you sure about this? I don't remember the quiz ever working like this. Is it possible that your Moodle 1.9 site had been customised by someone?
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        No response for 1 month, so I am closing this issue. Please comment if you think it should be reopened.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - No response for 1 month, so I am closing this issue. Please comment if you think it should be reopened.
        Hide
        Davo Smith added a comment -

        Tim, I just wanted to add to this bug report, that if you switch on outcomes in Moodle 1.9 then you are given an option to add outcomes to a quiz.

        This doesn't do anything within the quiz module, but does add extra columns to the grade report to allow users to assign outcomes there. Apparently, there are some organisations that were making use of it in 1.9.

        For the record, if that behaviour is desired, it is a relatively small code change to enable it.

        Show
        Davo Smith added a comment - Tim, I just wanted to add to this bug report, that if you switch on outcomes in Moodle 1.9 then you are given an option to add outcomes to a quiz. This doesn't do anything within the quiz module, but does add extra columns to the grade report to allow users to assign outcomes there. Apparently, there are some organisations that were making use of it in 1.9. For the record, if that behaviour is desired, it is a relatively small code change to enable it.
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        I wonder what effect making that setting had?!

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - I wonder what effect making that setting had?!
        Hide
        Helen Foster added a comment -

        I think this issue should be reopened. At the recent Ireland and UK MoodleMoot it came up that some organisations are hesitating to upgrade from 1.9 to 2.x because of lost functionality such as this in 2.x.

        Show
        Helen Foster added a comment - I think this issue should be reopened. At the recent Ireland and UK MoodleMoot it came up that some organisations are hesitating to upgrade from 1.9 to 2.x because of lost functionality such as this in 2.x.
        Hide
        Lindy Klein added a comment -

        Hi Tim,

        Sorry for the delay in responding to this one. 1.9 did allow you to do this without customisation, and we do have users of 2.x wanting the same functionality. Particularly when you're trying to track which activities contribute to learners achieving specific outcomes, this functionality is really useful. The workaround will achieve the same thing, but it's time consuming, and there's room for error in terms of selecting the wrong activity to link to without noticing it.

        I think it should be reopened, I've encouraged folks on the forum and our clients to come and comment on it if they think its important.

        Show
        Lindy Klein added a comment - Hi Tim, Sorry for the delay in responding to this one. 1.9 did allow you to do this without customisation, and we do have users of 2.x wanting the same functionality. Particularly when you're trying to track which activities contribute to learners achieving specific outcomes, this functionality is really useful. The workaround will achieve the same thing, but it's time consuming, and there's room for error in terms of selecting the wrong activity to link to without noticing it. I think it should be reopened, I've encouraged folks on the forum and our clients to come and comment on it if they think its important.
        Hide
        Lindy Klein added a comment -

        This tracker item is now mentioned in the forums here: http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=197773#p877426

        Show
        Lindy Klein added a comment - This tracker item is now mentioned in the forums here: http://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=197773#p877426
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        You still have not answered the qestion (in a way that I can understand).

        1. What quiz options were present in 1.9 that are no longer present in 2.x? (Give me a screen-grab, and some step-by step instructions for what I need to do to set up the same situation on my computer, since setting up outcomes is quite complex, and I have never really used them. The testing instructions above are two short. What is the 'Outcomes panel'? )

        2. What effect did setting those options have? Was anything visibly different in the quiz, or in the grade-book? If so, give me more screen-grabs.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - You still have not answered the qestion (in a way that I can understand). 1. What quiz options were present in 1.9 that are no longer present in 2.x? (Give me a screen-grab, and some step-by step instructions for what I need to do to set up the same situation on my computer, since setting up outcomes is quite complex, and I have never really used them. The testing instructions above are two short. What is the 'Outcomes panel'? ) 2. What effect did setting those options have? Was anything visibly different in the quiz, or in the grade-book? If so, give me more screen-grabs.
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        OK, so I was just looking at 1.9. mod/quiz/mod_form.php says:

                $features = new stdClass;
                $features->groups = true;
                $features->groupings = true;
                $features->groupmembersonly = true;
                $this->standard_coursemodule_elements($features);
        

        So, there does not appear to be any intention to add outcomes to the quiz settings form. It is just that in standard_coursemodule_elements (course/moodleform_mod.php) there is code like:

                if (!isset($this->_features->outcomes)) {
                    $this->_features->outcomes = true;
                }
        

        There is no mention of 'outcome' in the quiz code in 1.9, and I can't find any way to get any data into that outcome column, e.g. by attempting the quiz as a student.

        So, I am sure that the outcomes section of the form appearing at all was a bug that has been fixed in 2.x. That you managed to find the effect of the bug useful is remarkable.

        It would still be good to implement a proper (non-buggy) way to get a quiz to report scores against outcomes properly in the future, but I know of no specific plans to make that happen.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - OK, so I was just looking at 1.9. mod/quiz/mod_form.php says: $features = new stdClass; $features->groups = true ; $features->groupings = true ; $features->groupmembersonly = true ; $ this ->standard_coursemodule_elements($features); So, there does not appear to be any intention to add outcomes to the quiz settings form. It is just that in standard_coursemodule_elements (course/moodleform_mod.php) there is code like: if (!isset($ this ->_features->outcomes)) { $ this ->_features->outcomes = true ; } There is no mention of 'outcome' in the quiz code in 1.9, and I can't find any way to get any data into that outcome column, e.g. by attempting the quiz as a student. So, I am sure that the outcomes section of the form appearing at all was a bug that has been fixed in 2.x. That you managed to find the effect of the bug useful is remarkable. It would still be good to implement a proper (non-buggy) way to get a quiz to report scores against outcomes properly in the future, but I know of no specific plans to make that happen.
        Hide
        Ray Lawrence added a comment -

        Reading this with interest as it was mentioned to me recently and I couldn't recall seeing this as an option.

        A quick test later I still didn't see it. So even if it is only to satisfy my curiosity I'd welcome the steps to set this up - if it only shows me what I could have had (and didn't know it) and what I'm not going to get.

        Show
        Ray Lawrence added a comment - Reading this with interest as it was mentioned to me recently and I couldn't recall seeing this as an option. A quick test later I still didn't see it. So even if it is only to satisfy my curiosity I'd welcome the steps to set this up - if it only shows me what I could have had (and didn't know it) and what I'm not going to get.
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        Ray, options have to be enabled at the system level. In 1.9 that is somewhere in the grades admin setting. Then you have to actually define at least one scale and outcome in the course grade settings.

        If you can think of how this could usefully be implemented, then I am happy to listen and learn, even if I don't have plans to write any code for it any time soon.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - Ray, options have to be enabled at the system level. In 1.9 that is somewhere in the grades admin setting. Then you have to actually define at least one scale and outcome in the course grade settings. If you can think of how this could usefully be implemented, then I am happy to listen and learn, even if I don't have plans to write any code for it any time soon.
        Hide
        Lesli Smith added a comment - - edited

        Hi. So I really had to dig for a meaningful old screen shot since I no longer have access to a 1.9 system with outcomes turned on, but the attached shows some of my early experiments with using outcomes connected to quizzes; the pic file date says I took this in October 2010, so it was possible then. The upshot was this: it was possible to connect outcomes to a quiz globally but not to the questions themselves. It was useful, therefore, only when those outcomes summed up the main objectives of the whole quiz. The pop-quiz examples were short essay questions that got numeric grades with feedback via outcomes on places needed for improvement in text analysis logic, etc.

        I can see how schools would have adopted it already as I didn't know it was a feature that wasn't supposed to be there, either. It didn't seem like a bug to me...

        Show
        Lesli Smith added a comment - - edited Hi. So I really had to dig for a meaningful old screen shot since I no longer have access to a 1.9 system with outcomes turned on, but the attached shows some of my early experiments with using outcomes connected to quizzes; the pic file date says I took this in October 2010, so it was possible then. The upshot was this: it was possible to connect outcomes to a quiz globally but not to the questions themselves. It was useful, therefore, only when those outcomes summed up the main objectives of the whole quiz. The pop-quiz examples were short essay questions that got numeric grades with feedback via outcomes on places needed for improvement in text analysis logic, etc. I can see how schools would have adopted it already as I didn't know it was a feature that wasn't supposed to be there, either. It didn't seem like a bug to me...
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        It would be really helpful to see the screen grab of the grader report that corresponds to that outcome report, but I guess it is lost in the mists of time. Oh well.

        If you are feeling brave, try this: Open mod/quiz/lib.php in a plain text editor, and change the line

                case FEATURE_GRADE_OUTCOMES:          return false;
        

        so that it returns true instead of false, and see what happens.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - It would be really helpful to see the screen grab of the grader report that corresponds to that outcome report, but I guess it is lost in the mists of time. Oh well. If you are feeling brave, try this: Open mod/quiz/lib.php in a plain text editor, and change the line case FEATURE_GRADE_OUTCOMES: return false ; so that it returns true instead of false, and see what happens.
        Hide
        Lindy Klein added a comment -

        Hi Tim,

        I've updated the testing instructions above, and hope that it helps clarify. I've added screenshots of what quiz settings look like with Outcomes enabled, and what the Grader report looks like.

        You're quite right, there is no way of auto-marking the Outcomes. Instead, this allowed teachers to track which Outcomes were being demonstrated by which Assessment pieces. As far as I am aware, it is the same functionality with any other assessment piece - the Outcomes need to be manually graded in the Grader report using the scale attached to them.

        The benefit lies in being able to see what learning outcomes are actually being assessed in the course, and how often. A creative teacher may never actually grade against the outcomes, but use them instead to ensure course compliace with institutional learning objectives.

        Alternatively, one of our clients uses quiz to give several essay questions to students, in a case study style of assessment. She has to manually grade the answers anyway, but attaching the learning outcomes provides her with more information on how the students are progressing through the content.

        I hope this helps explain. Thanks for continuing the conversation, I appreciate it!

        Show
        Lindy Klein added a comment - Hi Tim, I've updated the testing instructions above, and hope that it helps clarify. I've added screenshots of what quiz settings look like with Outcomes enabled, and what the Grader report looks like. You're quite right, there is no way of auto-marking the Outcomes. Instead, this allowed teachers to track which Outcomes were being demonstrated by which Assessment pieces. As far as I am aware, it is the same functionality with any other assessment piece - the Outcomes need to be manually graded in the Grader report using the scale attached to them. The benefit lies in being able to see what learning outcomes are actually being assessed in the course, and how often. A creative teacher may never actually grade against the outcomes, but use them instead to ensure course compliace with institutional learning objectives. Alternatively, one of our clients uses quiz to give several essay questions to students, in a case study style of assessment. She has to manually grade the answers anyway, but attaching the learning outcomes provides her with more information on how the students are progressing through the content. I hope this helps explain. Thanks for continuing the conversation, I appreciate it!
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        I see, so what we had before was only a partial solution, but it still had its use.

        Are you able to try editing the code, as in my previous comment?

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - I see, so what we had before was only a partial solution, but it still had its use. Are you able to try editing the code, as in my previous comment?
        Hide
        Lesli Smith added a comment - - edited

        Hi, Tim. This particular functionality isn't yet crucial to the project I'm working on, but it will be. I can't edit the code myself, but the developers I'm working with could probably do it--if it doesn't impact core. Before I go to developers on this project with this fix, could you clarify for me if this will impact core? (Sorry. I can sometimes tell based on what I know regarding how things work together in Moodle if something will impact core, but this time I'm not sure what this means...)

        Show
        Lesli Smith added a comment - - edited Hi, Tim. This particular functionality isn't yet crucial to the project I'm working on, but it will be. I can't edit the code myself, but the developers I'm working with could probably do it--if it doesn't impact core. Before I go to developers on this project with this fix, could you clarify for me if this will impact core? (Sorry. I can sometimes tell based on what I know regarding how things work together in Moodle if something will impact core, but this time I'm not sure what this means...)
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        I don't quite know what you mean by 'impact core'. Of course it will change things, the whole point is that you don't like the current functionality, and want to change it!

        But, if you mean, are there likely to be bad side-effects, then the answer is almost certainly not - but we need to test it for real, which is why I am asking you to make the changes and confirm that it works the way you want.

        Basically, it is a very safe change to try, and if there are any problems at all, then you should just be able to change things back, and the problems will go away again.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - I don't quite know what you mean by 'impact core'. Of course it will change things, the whole point is that you don't like the current functionality, and want to change it! But, if you mean, are there likely to be bad side-effects, then the answer is almost certainly not - but we need to test it for real, which is why I am asking you to make the changes and confirm that it works the way you want. Basically, it is a very safe change to try, and if there are any problems at all, then you should just be able to change things back, and the problems will go away again.
        Hide
        Lesli Smith added a comment -

        Yes, I'm asking about the bad side effects and/or if it is a major change to fundamental Moodle quiz code (I guess that's what I meant to say--sorry about the core reference when it probably isn't accurate since quiz IS core. It is more about how I have things divied up in my head in terms of what is safe and what isn't. A peek into my layman's understanding. )

        Alright, I'll ask the developers to try it. Thanks!

        Show
        Lesli Smith added a comment - Yes, I'm asking about the bad side effects and/or if it is a major change to fundamental Moodle quiz code (I guess that's what I meant to say--sorry about the core reference when it probably isn't accurate since quiz IS core. It is more about how I have things divied up in my head in terms of what is safe and what isn't. A peek into my layman's understanding. ) Alright, I'll ask the developers to try it. Thanks!
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        Thanks. If you can confirm that this change does what you want, we can get in included in the official releases quite easily, I think.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - Thanks. If you can confirm that this change does what you want, we can get in included in the official releases quite easily, I think.
        Hide
        Lesli Smith added a comment -

        Hi, Tim. So far I can confirm that I'm seeing what I remember seeing before in the Quiz settings window in terms of being able to check off outcomes that apply to that particular quiz. I haven't yet gotten into seeing what happens in the grade book, but I will post back here again with screen shots to confirm after I've been able to test all the check points (grade book, reports, settings). Thanks!

        Show
        Lesli Smith added a comment - Hi, Tim. So far I can confirm that I'm seeing what I remember seeing before in the Quiz settings window in terms of being able to check off outcomes that apply to that particular quiz. I haven't yet gotten into seeing what happens in the grade book, but I will post back here again with screen shots to confirm after I've been able to test all the check points (grade book, reports, settings). Thanks!
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        Great thanks. I am about to disappear on holiday for 2 weeks, so don't worry if you don't get an immediate reply, but hopefully I will be able to attend to this as soon as I get back.

        I just noticed that I had never got around to re-opening this. Done now.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - Great thanks. I am about to disappear on holiday for 2 weeks, so don't worry if you don't get an immediate reply, but hopefully I will be able to attend to this as soon as I get back. I just noticed that I had never got around to re-opening this. Done now.
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        Lesli, did you ever find time to do some more testing?

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - Lesli, did you ever find time to do some more testing?
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        I have made pull branches for this change. Leslie, if you can confirm that this changes does actually resolve the problem, I can submit this for integration.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - I have made pull branches for this change. Leslie, if you can confirm that this changes does actually resolve the problem, I can submit this for integration.
        Hide
        Lesli Smith added a comment -

        Hi, Tim. We've upgraded through 2.1 to 2.2 to 2.3 and changed site locations since I was last able to look at this. We are just getting back into looking at outcomes again, so this is good timing for me. I'll let you know when I can confirm again if it works for 2.3 and then I'll also show what happens in the grade book.

        Show
        Lesli Smith added a comment - Hi, Tim. We've upgraded through 2.1 to 2.2 to 2.3 and changed site locations since I was last able to look at this. We are just getting back into looking at outcomes again, so this is good timing for me. I'll let you know when I can confirm again if it works for 2.3 and then I'll also show what happens in the grade book.
        Hide
        Lesli Smith added a comment -

        Hi, Tim. I can now confirm that this works as expected for 2.3, which is to say the following:

        1. The teacher can choose course outcomes in the edit settings options for the quiz. For the teacher's part, he/she either must choose outcomes that make sense for the entire quiz or reference the quiz question answer report to know how to assess outcome levels in the grade book.

        2. In the grade book, the quiz grade will show as expected next to the outcomes. The teacher must turn editing on to assess outcomes.

        Show
        Lesli Smith added a comment - Hi, Tim. I can now confirm that this works as expected for 2.3, which is to say the following: 1. The teacher can choose course outcomes in the edit settings options for the quiz. For the teacher's part, he/she either must choose outcomes that make sense for the entire quiz or reference the quiz question answer report to know how to assess outcome levels in the grade book. 2. In the grade book, the quiz grade will show as expected next to the outcomes. The teacher must turn editing on to assess outcomes.
        Hide
        Tim Hunt added a comment -

        Great. Thanks for the quick response. Submitting for integration now.

        Show
        Tim Hunt added a comment - Great. Thanks for the quick response. Submitting for integration now.
        Hide
        Dan Poltawski added a comment -

        Integrated, thanks everyone.

        Show
        Dan Poltawski added a comment - Integrated, thanks everyone.
        Hide
        David Monllaó added a comment -

        It passes. Tested in 2.2 and master

        Show
        David Monllaó added a comment - It passes. Tested in 2.2 and master
        Hide
        Dan Poltawski added a comment -

        asko, Дзякуй, ধন্যবাদ, Благодаря, Gràcies, 感谢, 謝謝, Hvala, Díky, Tak, Bedankt, Tänan, متشکریم, Salamat, Kiitokset, Merci, Grazas, Danke, Ευχαριστώ, આભાર, תודה, धन्यवाद, Köszönjük, Takk fyrir, Terima Kasih, Grazie, ありがとうございます, Рахмет, សូមអរគុណ, 감사합니다, gratiās, Pateicamies, Ačiū, Благодарам, Tēnā koa, Kia Ora Rawa Atu, आभारी आहोत, Талархал, Takk, Dziękuję, Obrigado, Mulţumesc, Engraziel, Спасибо, Fa'afetai, Хвала, Hvala, ස්තූතියි, Vďaka, Hvala, Mahadsanid, Thanks, Gracias, Tack, Salamat, நன்றி, నెనరులు, ขอบคุณค่ะ!

        Your work has made it into this weeks Moodle release! There are no gold medals available this week - but millions around the world will benefit. Thank you!

        Show
        Dan Poltawski added a comment - asko, Дзякуй, ধন্যবাদ, Благодаря, Gràcies, 感谢, 謝謝, Hvala, Díky, Tak, Bedankt, Tänan, متشکریم, Salamat, Kiitokset, Merci, Grazas, Danke, Ευχαριστώ, આભાર, תודה, धन्यवाद, Köszönjük, Takk fyrir, Terima Kasih, Grazie, ありがとうございます, Рахмет, សូមអរគុណ, 감사합니다, gratiās, Pateicamies, Ačiū, Благодарам, Tēnā koa, Kia Ora Rawa Atu, आभारी आहोत, Талархал, Takk, Dziękuję, Obrigado, Mulţumesc, Engraziel, Спасибо, Fa'afetai, Хвала, Hvala, ස්තූතියි, Vďaka, Hvala, Mahadsanid, Thanks, Gracias, Tack, Salamat, நன்றி, నెనరులు, ขอบคุณค่ะ! Your work has made it into this weeks Moodle release! There are no gold medals available this week - but millions around the world will benefit. Thank you!

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            • Created:
              Updated:
              Resolved: