Details

    • Type: Sub-task Sub-task
    • Status: Closed
    • Priority: Major Major
    • Resolution: Fixed
    • Affects Version/s: 2.5
    • Fix Version/s: FRONTEND
    • Component/s: Themes
    • Labels:
    • Affected Branches:
      MOODLE_25_STABLE
    • Rank:
      49001

      Description

      Here are recent checkins to integration with CSS for /theme/base that need to be checked for corresponding CSS in /theme/bootstrap

      http://git.moodle.org/gw?p=integration.git;a=history;f=theme/base;hb=HEAD;opt=--no-merges

        Issue Links

          Activity

          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          Adding some watchers here to be aware of this.

          Currently /theme/bootstrap and /theme/base are the two themes that have no parents, so BOTH of them need to be updated for any new developments. Sorry for the annoyance.

          I hope we can encourage most people to move to bootstrap-based themes in the next couple of releases so that eventually we can stop updating /theme/base. But that may be a while off.

          Can we update docs everywhere to reflect this?

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - Adding some watchers here to be aware of this. Currently /theme/bootstrap and /theme/base are the two themes that have no parents, so BOTH of them need to be updated for any new developments. Sorry for the annoyance. I hope we can encourage most people to move to bootstrap-based themes in the next couple of releases so that eventually we can stop updating /theme/base. But that may be a while off. Can we update docs everywhere to reflect this?
          Hide
          David Scotson added a comment -

          We should figure out when we "branched" by looking at the github history.

          I'd been manually keeping an eye on this, just by diffing the trees every so often, but checking via the git logs makes more sense.

          We also exclude some styles.css from modular components, currently block_html, block_navigation, block_settings and gradereport_grader.

          Show
          David Scotson added a comment - We should figure out when we "branched" by looking at the github history. I'd been manually keeping an eye on this, just by diffing the trees every so often, but checking via the git logs makes more sense. We also exclude some styles.css from modular components, currently block_html, block_navigation, block_settings and gradereport_grader.
          Hide
          David Scotson added a comment -

          The commit with the split from Base happened on 25th Feb, but I'm not sure how up-to-date the stuff getting merged in was at that point compared with master. I can find the updates made on the 5th Feb from the list above in the initial checkin diff though so it's somewhere between those two dates. However, since there's only about 10 changes in that timeframe, taking the earlier date seems sensible rather than waste time tracking down the exact point of divergence.

          "Import base css and pix into Bootstrap"
          https://github.com/bmbrands/theme_bootstrap/commit/ee10bfdff07fdb7f4eecc2c832fc8d4831a7f229

          Show
          David Scotson added a comment - The commit with the split from Base happened on 25th Feb, but I'm not sure how up-to-date the stuff getting merged in was at that point compared with master. I can find the updates made on the 5th Feb from the list above in the initial checkin diff though so it's somewhere between those two dates. However, since there's only about 10 changes in that timeframe, taking the earlier date seems sensible rather than waste time tracking down the exact point of divergence. "Import base css and pix into Bootstrap" https://github.com/bmbrands/theme_bootstrap/commit/ee10bfdff07fdb7f4eecc2c832fc8d4831a7f229
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          It may make things easier for Bootstrap, if we take out of base CSS all the mods and block fixes and add them back to their respective styles.css stylesheets!

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - It may make things easier for Bootstrap, if we take out of base CSS all the mods and block fixes and add them back to their respective styles.css stylesheets!
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          It would make everything much simpler if we tried to implement some of Bootstrap's strategy into Moodle CORE by making all the mods and blocks and other element adhere to the principles of the Bootstrap design model.

          Base css is a shambles.

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - It would make everything much simpler if we tried to implement some of Bootstrap's strategy into Moodle CORE by making all the mods and blocks and other element adhere to the principles of the Bootstrap design model. Base css is a shambles.
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          David, I need to learn how to convert the BASE theme CSS to work in Bootstrap. Can you help me do this? Thanks

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - David, I need to learn how to convert the BASE theme CSS to work in Bootstrap. Can you help me do this? Thanks
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          Just had a brain wave of an idea. Do you think it viable to convert all CORE themes to use Bootstrap as a parent theme and lose BASE & CANVAS all together? It's just that I was thinking of trying it out on something like Standard or Boxxie? Or am I just a 'Crazy Themer'?

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - Just had a brain wave of an idea. Do you think it viable to convert all CORE themes to use Bootstrap as a parent theme and lose BASE & CANVAS all together? It's just that I was thinking of trying it out on something like Standard or Boxxie? Or am I just a 'Crazy Themer'?
          Hide
          David Scotson added a comment -

          I'd be interested to see what the results where if you just changed the current themes to point at Bootstrap as their parent rather than Base.

          I doubt it would "just work" but it might be very close, you'd have to try to find out.

          Show
          David Scotson added a comment - I'd be interested to see what the results where if you just changed the current themes to point at Bootstrap as their parent rather than Base. I doubt it would "just work" but it might be very close, you'd have to try to find out.
          Hide
          Richard Oelmann added a comment -

          This may be a good long term goal Mary, but please don't kill every community theme out there that uses Base and Canvas without giving LOTS of time to get them reworked AFTER a bootstrap base is finalised/stabilised/proven by use and adopted by more and more of the community. And for myself, that would mean after all the 'renderer' type changes have gone into moodle core rather than being part of the theme and needing to be changed frequently as moodle core is updated to include more of this.
          Also, do we need to consider whether we are moving towards locking Moodle in to bootstrap (which version?) and making it harder to use any other frameworks in the future? Surely well coded core should be able to be used with any css framework, but at the moment all the discussion seems to be about rewriting things to fit with bootstrap - or is this just my lack of understanding of the issue - is 'bootstrap' gradually becoming used as a generic term for 'framework suitable, well written code'?

          For the time being, I would suggest BASE and CANVAS should NOT get lost entirely - even if core themes are converted to use bootstrap instead.

          Show
          Richard Oelmann added a comment - This may be a good long term goal Mary, but please don't kill every community theme out there that uses Base and Canvas without giving LOTS of time to get them reworked AFTER a bootstrap base is finalised/stabilised/proven by use and adopted by more and more of the community. And for myself, that would mean after all the 'renderer' type changes have gone into moodle core rather than being part of the theme and needing to be changed frequently as moodle core is updated to include more of this. Also, do we need to consider whether we are moving towards locking Moodle in to bootstrap (which version?) and making it harder to use any other frameworks in the future? Surely well coded core should be able to be used with any css framework, but at the moment all the discussion seems to be about rewriting things to fit with bootstrap - or is this just my lack of understanding of the issue - is 'bootstrap' gradually becoming used as a generic term for 'framework suitable, well written code'? For the time being, I would suggest BASE and CANVAS should NOT get lost entirely - even if core themes are converted to use bootstrap instead.
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          Yes I agree with Richard, there is a huge legacy pool of themes to support, and we TOLD them all to use /theme/base to minimise upgrade problems. So the changeover needs to be managed well (not rushed in 2.5 or probably even 2.6).

          Hopefully the attractiveness of bootstrap can help people decide to put in the work converting their themes, but we need to make bootstrap a very solid foundation to build on first.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - Yes I agree with Richard, there is a huge legacy pool of themes to support, and we TOLD them all to use /theme/base to minimise upgrade problems. So the changeover needs to be managed well (not rushed in 2.5 or probably even 2.6). Hopefully the attractiveness of bootstrap can help people decide to put in the work converting their themes, but we need to make bootstrap a very solid foundation to build on first.
          Hide
          David Scotson added a comment -

          I took Mary's comment to mean moving the themes that come packed with Moodle over to inheriting from Bootstrap rather than Base. Which I think is a very achievable goal for 2.6 and, since they're themes and so disconnected from core, could even be done before then and used by the more adventurous types shortly after 2.5 goes live. Indeed it would probably be best if they worked in 2.3 and 2.4 as well to get the long-term migration started as early as possible.

          Quite a few people are asking about the best way to extend Bootstrap in Moodle so writing a how-to showing the benefits of the new approach is very high on my todo list. It'll be loosely based on this article, by the chap behind Bootswatch.com: http://coding.smashingmagazine.com/2013/03/12/customizing-bootstrap/ but with an example starter Moodle theme for people to build on as well.

          Porting some of the themes that come with Moodle (as well as some from the Bootstrap community) as a demo would probably be a part of that, and I'd be hopeful that current Moodle Themers would join in and try porting their own themes, as they'll probably provide the most informed feedback on what needs to be improved. It's also the same technique I'll be using for our institution's theme when updating this summer to 2.4 so I'm personally invested in it working well.

          But yes, you can't actually "lose" Base & Canvas until everyone that builds on them moves on. On the other hand, you may want to deprecate them and stop putting full effort into them, possibly fairly soon. And I think that's perhaps what Mary meant.

          There's been a few conversations recently where people have said things like "get rid of", "kill" etc. when they really meant "decide to build on something else for the future and deprecate this in an orderly manner without unduly affecting those who rely on it while transferring as many people as quickly as possible to take advantage of the new way to our/their collective benefit". It's just not as much fun to say it that way but it is very important to communicate that well to avoid unnecessarily worrying people.

          As for "Bootstrap" vs "Any modern HTML/CSS framework", they overlap so much that I think it is fair to consider them pretty much interchangeable in most conversations. Doubly so if you consider that Bootstrap is transitioning from 2.3 to 3 (and the latter version should probably be targeted for 2.6) so even just addressing "Bootstrap" alone you can paint yourself into a corner if you take too many shortcuts (though some people seem a bit freaked out by the thought of Bootstrap changing version and I don't mean to add to that, it's really not that dramatic an upgrade, more a streamlining of what's currently there). Bootstrap does however present a very concrete rallying point and reference for collaboration, much more so than a vaguer, more abstract goal would.

          The key thing, imho, is to have more renderers at the right level of granularity and I think working towards a goal of implementing Bootstrap (which is fundamentally a collection of re-usable components) is the best way to get there quickly.

          Show
          David Scotson added a comment - I took Mary's comment to mean moving the themes that come packed with Moodle over to inheriting from Bootstrap rather than Base. Which I think is a very achievable goal for 2.6 and, since they're themes and so disconnected from core, could even be done before then and used by the more adventurous types shortly after 2.5 goes live. Indeed it would probably be best if they worked in 2.3 and 2.4 as well to get the long-term migration started as early as possible. Quite a few people are asking about the best way to extend Bootstrap in Moodle so writing a how-to showing the benefits of the new approach is very high on my todo list. It'll be loosely based on this article, by the chap behind Bootswatch.com: http://coding.smashingmagazine.com/2013/03/12/customizing-bootstrap/ but with an example starter Moodle theme for people to build on as well. Porting some of the themes that come with Moodle (as well as some from the Bootstrap community) as a demo would probably be a part of that, and I'd be hopeful that current Moodle Themers would join in and try porting their own themes, as they'll probably provide the most informed feedback on what needs to be improved. It's also the same technique I'll be using for our institution's theme when updating this summer to 2.4 so I'm personally invested in it working well. But yes, you can't actually "lose" Base & Canvas until everyone that builds on them moves on. On the other hand, you may want to deprecate them and stop putting full effort into them, possibly fairly soon. And I think that's perhaps what Mary meant. There's been a few conversations recently where people have said things like "get rid of", "kill" etc. when they really meant "decide to build on something else for the future and deprecate this in an orderly manner without unduly affecting those who rely on it while transferring as many people as quickly as possible to take advantage of the new way to our/their collective benefit". It's just not as much fun to say it that way but it is very important to communicate that well to avoid unnecessarily worrying people. As for "Bootstrap" vs "Any modern HTML/CSS framework", they overlap so much that I think it is fair to consider them pretty much interchangeable in most conversations. Doubly so if you consider that Bootstrap is transitioning from 2.3 to 3 (and the latter version should probably be targeted for 2.6) so even just addressing "Bootstrap" alone you can paint yourself into a corner if you take too many shortcuts (though some people seem a bit freaked out by the thought of Bootstrap changing version and I don't mean to add to that, it's really not that dramatic an upgrade, more a streamlining of what's currently there). Bootstrap does however present a very concrete rallying point and reference for collaboration, much more so than a vaguer, more abstract goal would. The key thing, imho, is to have more renderers at the right level of granularity and I think working towards a goal of implementing Bootstrap (which is fundamentally a collection of re-usable components) is the best way to get there quickly.
          Hide
          Richard Oelmann added a comment -

          David, I'm afraid I disagree with you about deprecating and not putting full effort into base and canvas - for as long as they are part of core they should continue to receive the same full consideration as any other part of core. And I'm not sure either that I agree with your assertion that themes are so 'disconnected from core' - without the themes, nothing in core displays!
          I'm not trying to argue against moving forward with bootstrap, but just the speed with which things are happening and being suggested. Although many themers (myself, Mary, Danny and many others) will I'm sure adopt bootstrap or similar frameworks as a result of the work you and Bas and others have done, there are an enormous number of people out there who manage their own themes for small schools/institutions who rely on the stability of existing core code such as base/canvas. What I (and this is only a personal opinion) would like to see is bootstrap in core and allowed to stabilise and be adopted on a wider base - this may be encouraged by converting existing core themes to use it as a parent rather than the existing base/canvas, but without removing ANY support from those in the first instance in the recognition that the core themes are a very small percentage of the themes out there! Once bootstrap is adopted more widely and is proven by use, not just by 'lab testing' THEN we should think about deprecating base/canvas.

          Maybe its just my impression but this rush towards 'the next best thing' seems to be more prevalent at the moment with 2.5 than with any other update I recall recently (I'm not just talking about bootstrap and themes now!) and the language being used, as you identify is giving me cause for concern - 'get rid of'/'kill off' etc are (to me at least) a long way removed from 'an ordered deprecation' of existing code. It's been suggested for other areas as well (text editors spring instantly to mind!) and recently I have seen it suggested that 2.5 may include validation to ensure plugins do not use Jquery outside the brand new method which I would think would 'kill off' a lot of existing plugins.
          Again, I am not trying to argue against the move forward - just trying to ensure that discussion is had about the protection of the legacy stuff from being broken by things going too fast! And that's not specifically related to this thread!

          Richard

          Show
          Richard Oelmann added a comment - David, I'm afraid I disagree with you about deprecating and not putting full effort into base and canvas - for as long as they are part of core they should continue to receive the same full consideration as any other part of core. And I'm not sure either that I agree with your assertion that themes are so 'disconnected from core' - without the themes, nothing in core displays! I'm not trying to argue against moving forward with bootstrap, but just the speed with which things are happening and being suggested. Although many themers (myself, Mary, Danny and many others) will I'm sure adopt bootstrap or similar frameworks as a result of the work you and Bas and others have done, there are an enormous number of people out there who manage their own themes for small schools/institutions who rely on the stability of existing core code such as base/canvas. What I (and this is only a personal opinion) would like to see is bootstrap in core and allowed to stabilise and be adopted on a wider base - this may be encouraged by converting existing core themes to use it as a parent rather than the existing base/canvas, but without removing ANY support from those in the first instance in the recognition that the core themes are a very small percentage of the themes out there! Once bootstrap is adopted more widely and is proven by use, not just by 'lab testing' THEN we should think about deprecating base/canvas. Maybe its just my impression but this rush towards 'the next best thing' seems to be more prevalent at the moment with 2.5 than with any other update I recall recently (I'm not just talking about bootstrap and themes now!) and the language being used, as you identify is giving me cause for concern - 'get rid of'/'kill off' etc are (to me at least) a long way removed from 'an ordered deprecation' of existing code. It's been suggested for other areas as well (text editors spring instantly to mind!) and recently I have seen it suggested that 2.5 may include validation to ensure plugins do not use Jquery outside the brand new method which I would think would 'kill off' a lot of existing plugins. Again, I am not trying to argue against the move forward - just trying to ensure that discussion is had about the protection of the legacy stuff from being broken by things going too fast! And that's not specifically related to this thread! Richard
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          As of today (because Bootstrap has been integrated into the current master branch of git://github.com/moodle/moodle.git), ALL Moodle developers, when updating BASE theme, will also be obliged to update BOOTSTRAP theme too. This is going to be a lot of work, so as I see it the sooner we stop using BASE and move over to Bootstrap the better it will be.

          There are some massive changes in Moodle 2.5 and nothing to do with themes, it's mainly all core stuff and the current themes are working OK.

          At the moment Bootstrap is just another Moodle theme, but it is slowly changing the face of Moodle, especially for Mobile and Tablet devices. It's exciting, but also frustrating and maddening at the same time, as there is so much to learn. But then so was Moodle 2.0 at the beginning, when all the Moodle 1.9 themes got left behind and new ones were introduced. But we coped and learned an awful lot.

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - As of today (because Bootstrap has been integrated into the current master branch of git://github.com/moodle/moodle.git), ALL Moodle developers, when updating BASE theme, will also be obliged to update BOOTSTRAP theme too. This is going to be a lot of work, so as I see it the sooner we stop using BASE and move over to Bootstrap the better it will be. There are some massive changes in Moodle 2.5 and nothing to do with themes, it's mainly all core stuff and the current themes are working OK. At the moment Bootstrap is just another Moodle theme, but it is slowly changing the face of Moodle, especially for Mobile and Tablet devices. It's exciting, but also frustrating and maddening at the same time, as there is so much to learn. But then so was Moodle 2.0 at the beginning, when all the Moodle 1.9 themes got left behind and new ones were introduced. But we coped and learned an awful lot.
          Hide
          Richard Oelmann added a comment -

          I've just written a long post here and then deleted it because I don't want to come across as being negative towards things moving forward - I'm not! I find the concept of bootstrap very exciting (if more than a little daunting and wondering where I'm going to find time to learn about bootstrap/less and everything else that appear to be going to be needed to push themes further forward). I would just like to reiterate my plea that base/canvas should continue to receive FULL support as part of core until such time as theme maintainers - I'm not just talking about Mary, myself, Danny and people like us who are active on the forums, but those in the wider community - are given opportunity to adjust and adopt new themes. This is different to the jump between 1.9->2.0 that was a complete version jump in Moodle. We already have one regression (at least that's how I see it) over the flexibility of blocks that worked in 2.2 and not in 2.3 or since (and the fixes currently in place do not provide the same flexibility!) that means that some themes which were written for 2.0-2.2 ceased to function as expected from 2.3 and above. I strongly believe we need to avoid the situation where themes for 2.4 don't work for 2.5 (or 2.6) by removing base/canvas.
          That doesn't mean I don't think we should move core themes over to using bootstrap as their parent, I think that is a good idea and will speed up the wider adoption of bootstrap as the default framework for moodle themes. But base and canvas need to stay there and be maintained fully for as long as they are there.

          Show
          Richard Oelmann added a comment - I've just written a long post here and then deleted it because I don't want to come across as being negative towards things moving forward - I'm not! I find the concept of bootstrap very exciting (if more than a little daunting and wondering where I'm going to find time to learn about bootstrap/less and everything else that appear to be going to be needed to push themes further forward). I would just like to reiterate my plea that base/canvas should continue to receive FULL support as part of core until such time as theme maintainers - I'm not just talking about Mary, myself, Danny and people like us who are active on the forums, but those in the wider community - are given opportunity to adjust and adopt new themes. This is different to the jump between 1.9->2.0 that was a complete version jump in Moodle. We already have one regression (at least that's how I see it) over the flexibility of blocks that worked in 2.2 and not in 2.3 or since (and the fixes currently in place do not provide the same flexibility!) that means that some themes which were written for 2.0-2.2 ceased to function as expected from 2.3 and above. I strongly believe we need to avoid the situation where themes for 2.4 don't work for 2.5 (or 2.6) by removing base/canvas. That doesn't mean I don't think we should move core themes over to using bootstrap as their parent, I think that is a good idea and will speed up the wider adoption of bootstrap as the default framework for moodle themes. But base and canvas need to stay there and be maintained fully for as long as they are there.
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - - edited

          Even moving the current core themes over to bootstrap from base needs to be done carefully as there are themes based on those.

          But back to the original point of this bug, can someone check that list I posted in the desc and make sure bootstrap has all those changes?

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - - edited Even moving the current core themes over to bootstrap from base needs to be done carefully as there are themes based on those. But back to the original point of this bug, can someone check that list I posted in the desc and make sure bootstrap has all those changes?
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          @Richard,

          I think you are worrying unduly about something that will be taken care of in-house so to speak. We are certainly not going to allow custom themes to become redundant because of the changes taking place in Moodle 2.5+ and will most certainly make sure for subsequent versions, 2.6+ and beyond. By that time, hopefully, conversion to a Bootstrap design model will have been fully integrated into Moodle and themes will no longer be as we know them, but just a single template (more or LESS). We are probably talking c2015 which is a long while off yet.

          But then again, something better may have come along!

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - @Richard, I think you are worrying unduly about something that will be taken care of in-house so to speak. We are certainly not going to allow custom themes to become redundant because of the changes taking place in Moodle 2.5+ and will most certainly make sure for subsequent versions, 2.6+ and beyond. By that time, hopefully, conversion to a Bootstrap design model will have been fully integrated into Moodle and themes will no longer be as we know them, but just a single template (more or LESS). We are probably talking c2015 which is a long while off yet. But then again, something better may have come along!
          Hide
          Richard Oelmann added a comment -

          Thanks for the comment Mary - maybe I am worrying unduly, but I'm also passing on comments/concerns that have already been made to me
          Richard

          Show
          Richard Oelmann added a comment - Thanks for the comment Mary - maybe I am worrying unduly, but I'm also passing on comments/concerns that have already been made to me Richard
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          @Martin: It's all well and good saying that the list of commits from the end of February needs to be added into Bootstrap. I think this is easy said than done.

          I'm not sure where one puts the CSS in Bootstrap.

          I may need a tutorial.

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - @Martin: It's all well and good saying that the list of commits from the end of February needs to be added into Bootstrap. I think this is easy said than done. I'm not sure where one puts the CSS in Bootstrap. I may need a tutorial.
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          OK, so from a quick look at the code this needs to be done:

          1) Edit source files in /theme/bootstrap/less/moodle with new css.
          2) (If files are added/renamed then update /theme/bootstrap/less/moodle.less to be aware of the changes)
          3) Follow /theme/bootstrap/less/README to generate the final css files.
          4) Test that Moodle under Bootstrap now does the right thing as expected.
          5) Submit the new changes to bootstrap

          I have to say that all the instructions surrounding less are quite crappy at the moment and should be made a LOT simpler for themers to understand. I hope this was a good decision to go for less.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - OK, so from a quick look at the code this needs to be done: 1) Edit source files in /theme/bootstrap/less/moodle with new css. 2) (If files are added/renamed then update /theme/bootstrap/less/moodle.less to be aware of the changes) 3) Follow /theme/bootstrap/less/README to generate the final css files. 4) Test that Moodle under Bootstrap now does the right thing as expected. 5) Submit the new changes to bootstrap I have to say that all the instructions surrounding less are quite crappy at the moment and should be made a LOT simpler for themers to understand. I hope this was a good decision to go for less.
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment - - edited

          @Martin:
          I don't know enough about LESS to comment. But if LESS was in Moodle core and not in Bootstrap theme, then I suspect it could be made to work automatically on the click of a button as an Admin setting, which would make it easier all round.

          That said, however, Bootstrap, like Base is not meant to be used as a theme in it's own right. Therefore, should we not be thinking about a new child theme like Standard is to Base theme, so that it becomes the new 'default' theme for Moodle 2.5, or if you prefer to delay this, then at least consider it for Moodle 2.6? The new default theme could have a settings page to add custom css, but not LESS.

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - - edited @Martin: I don't know enough about LESS to comment. But if LESS was in Moodle core and not in Bootstrap theme, then I suspect it could be made to work automatically on the click of a button as an Admin setting, which would make it easier all round. That said, however, Bootstrap, like Base is not meant to be used as a theme in it's own right. Therefore, should we not be thinking about a new child theme like Standard is to Base theme, so that it becomes the new 'default' theme for Moodle 2.5, or if you prefer to delay this, then at least consider it for Moodle 2.6? The new default theme could have a settings page to add custom css, but not LESS.
          Hide
          Richard Oelmann added a comment -

          +1 for Mary's comment about a new bootstrap 'standard' - should bootstrap itself also have the
          $THEME->hidefromselector = true;
          as base does?
          I would imagine the idea then is to use bootstrap 'untouched' as a parent and for end users (well end themers) not to edit it at all - any changes being made in the child themes as is current practice with base/canvas.

          Show
          Richard Oelmann added a comment - +1 for Mary's comment about a new bootstrap 'standard' - should bootstrap itself also have the $THEME->hidefromselector = true; as base does? I would imagine the idea then is to use bootstrap 'untouched' as a parent and for end users (well end themers) not to edit it at all - any changes being made in the child themes as is current practice with base/canvas.
          Hide
          Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) added a comment -

          +1 for bootstrap to be considered like base (aka not pickable) and quickly build an "bootstrap_standard" on top of it.

          Show
          Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) added a comment - +1 for bootstrap to be considered like base (aka not pickable) and quickly build an "bootstrap_standard" on top of it.
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          MDL-39010 was created for "hiding" bootstrap from the UI like base. +1

          Also +1 for a new 'standard' theme then (I like "standardbs" or "standard2" as a name, shorter than bootstrap_standard and more future-looking) which should land at the same time as the above. I made MDL-39021 for this to be done ASAP.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - MDL-39010 was created for "hiding" bootstrap from the UI like base. +1 Also +1 for a new 'standard' theme then (I like "standardbs" or "standard2" as a name, shorter than bootstrap_standard and more future-looking) which should land at the same time as the above. I made MDL-39021 for this to be done ASAP.
          Hide
          David Scotson added a comment -

          If anyone wants to go through the list and identify what standard does differently now, and whether Bootstrap does it/doesn't do it/doesn't need to do it then I'll advise on where and how to make changes.

          I'll do it myself anyway, but a second pair of eyes is always useful, it's not a necessarily straightforward mechanical process, and things can interact.

          Show
          David Scotson added a comment - If anyone wants to go through the list and identify what standard does differently now, and whether Bootstrap does it/doesn't do it/doesn't need to do it then I'll advise on where and how to make changes. I'll do it myself anyway, but a second pair of eyes is always useful, it's not a necessarily straightforward mechanical process, and things can interact.
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          Marina is taking care of all the course listings and link it here. The other major one is already linked MDL-38922. Not sure about the little ones yet.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - Marina is taking care of all the course listings and link it here. The other major one is already linked MDL-38922 . Not sure about the little ones yet.
          Hide
          Marina Glancy added a comment -

          Created issue MDL-39064 for course listings CSS changes

          Show
          Marina Glancy added a comment - Created issue MDL-39064 for course listings CSS changes
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          MDL-38751 is another one that didn't get into bootstrap.

          It changes the cancel buttons into links.

          I'm a little unsure if this needs to be ported.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - MDL-38751 is another one that didn't get into bootstrap. It changes the cancel buttons into links. I'm a little unsure if this needs to be ported.
          Hide
          Michael de Raadt added a comment -

          If there are no further un-ported changes, this issue could probably be closed.

          Show
          Michael de Raadt added a comment - If there are no further un-ported changes, this issue could probably be closed.
          Hide
          Mary Evans added a comment -

          Closing:
          I think this can be closed as all the CSS that is relevant to Bootstrapbase is in place. Changes are still ongoing to reduce the load. So all is well and one less issue to worry about.

          Show
          Mary Evans added a comment - Closing: I think this can be closed as all the CSS that is relevant to Bootstrapbase is in place. Changes are still ongoing to reduce the load. So all is well and one less issue to worry about.

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