Moodle
  1. Moodle
  2. MDL-9085

Provide edit field option instead of 1 - 100 dropdown menu for entering grades

    Details

    • Affected Branches:
      MOODLE_17_STABLE, MOODLE_18_STABLE, MOODLE_19_STABLE
    • Rank:
      1758

      Description

      This is a request for an edit field option in graded activities (Assignment, other?) instead of the dropdown 0 - 100 menu. I work with some faculty who find repeatedly pulling down this long menu very time consuming, aggravating, and (sometimes) prone to errors if you don't happen to grab the right number. (I often grab the wrong expire year for my credit card when purchasing something online.)

      Personally, I agree and find that I can type in scores much faster than pulling-down menus. I feel that directly typing the score is at least as accurate and sometimes more accurate than dropdown menus.

      Don't know if you've gotten any other feedback or requests, but I believe it's definitely worthy of checking out. I put "Major" priority as I didn't think "Minor" conveyed the aggravation factor, but certainly this is a usability issue not a funtcionality issue.

      Best regards,
      Lane Grann-Stahl
      Instructional Developer
      Central Piedmont community College
      Charlotte, NC

      1. assign-grade.patch
        16 kB
        Robert Puffer
      2. lib.php
        129 kB
        Robert Puffer

        Issue Links

          Activity

          Hide
          Matthew Davidson added a comment -

          This needs fixed.

          Show
          Matthew Davidson added a comment - This needs fixed.
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          In Moodle 1.9 you can grade using the gradebook, which allows raw data entry. The assignment module still has a drop down though.

          However, did you realise that you can still type even though there is a menu? Your browser will just select the right item from the menu.

          It's been designed so that you can type 45<TAB>46<TAB>77 etc

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - In Moodle 1.9 you can grade using the gradebook, which allows raw data entry. The assignment module still has a drop down though. However, did you realise that you can still type even though there is a menu? Your browser will just select the right item from the menu. It's been designed so that you can type 45<TAB>46<TAB>77 etc
          Hide
          Matthew Davidson added a comment -

          That still leaves what I consider to be the biggest problem though. If a teacher has a quiz which is worth 200 points, but the assignment only lets them go to 100, they would have to go through the gradebook manually doubling the students scores. Why not just have a text box for grade value if "Point system" is selected. You can use javascript to validate that it is a number > 0.

          Show
          Matthew Davidson added a comment - That still leaves what I consider to be the biggest problem though. If a teacher has a quiz which is worth 200 points, but the assignment only lets them go to 100, they would have to go through the gradebook manually doubling the students scores. Why not just have a text box for grade value if "Point system" is selected. You can use javascript to validate that it is a number > 0.
          Hide
          Rob Byrd added a comment -

          This issue (MDL-9085) states UNRESOLVED, but I think it is resolved. When I want to enter a specific grade it I type 85 with focus on the grade scale (not graded, 1-100) it goes right to the correct grade (85), as long as I don't delay between the 8 and the 5. If I type 8 and wait a second it goes to 89. If I then type 5, it goes to 59. But when I type 85 quickly (with no hesitation between the 8 and the 5, 85 is selected in the dropdown box and and I simply tab to the next field--comments. I don't need to down-arrow to the exact grade. (In case this is browser or platform specific, this works in Linux (using FireFox) and Mac (using either Firefox or Safari).

          Show
          Rob Byrd added a comment - This issue ( MDL-9085 ) states UNRESOLVED, but I think it is resolved. When I want to enter a specific grade it I type 85 with focus on the grade scale (not graded, 1-100) it goes right to the correct grade (85), as long as I don't delay between the 8 and the 5. If I type 8 and wait a second it goes to 89. If I then type 5, it goes to 59. But when I type 85 quickly (with no hesitation between the 8 and the 5, 85 is selected in the dropdown box and and I simply tab to the next field--comments. I don't need to down-arrow to the exact grade. (In case this is browser or platform specific, this works in Linux (using FireFox) and Mac (using either Firefox or Safari).
          Hide
          Matthew Davidson added a comment -

          the problem isn't so much that finding a number between 1-100 is slow or difficult...try making something worth 115 points

          Show
          Matthew Davidson added a comment - the problem isn't so much that finding a number between 1-100 is slow or difficult...try making something worth 115 points
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          Since 1.9.5 we've had the 'unlimitedgrades' option that allows grades over 100. And as I said you can use the keyboard on menus.

          We can keep this bug open if people still want an edit box with extra JS checks (and a whole lot of stuff to make this work on large gradebooks even when JS is off, which is tricky), but personally I'd rate this really really low priority.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - Since 1.9.5 we've had the 'unlimitedgrades' option that allows grades over 100. And as I said you can use the keyboard on menus. We can keep this bug open if people still want an edit box with extra JS checks (and a whole lot of stuff to make this work on large gradebooks even when JS is off, which is tricky), but personally I'd rate this really really low priority.
          Hide
          Eric Merrill added a comment -

          I guess I don't understand how unlimitedgrades has anything to do with this...

          unlimitedgrades allows me to assign a grade to a user of 140 out of 100, but it doesn't allow me to make the 'out of' grade over 100 in the assignment tool - eg I want 140 out of 150...

          I think that it should be more than 'trivial', but I would agree this isn't a major.

          Show
          Eric Merrill added a comment - I guess I don't understand how unlimitedgrades has anything to do with this... unlimitedgrades allows me to assign a grade to a user of 140 out of 100, but it doesn't allow me to make the 'out of' grade over 100 in the assignment tool - eg I want 140 out of 150... I think that it should be more than 'trivial', but I would agree this isn't a major.
          Hide
          Robert Puffer added a comment -

          This issue would like to pretend to be trivial but in fact, is quite important due mostly to how often an instructor must workaround Moodle's default behavior. It is not resolved by "unlimited grades" which pertains only to the grading from the gradebook, not from the assignment, where uploaded files or online text are easily viewable in the grading context.
          Eric's assessment of the need is right-on... for me the issue cannot be considered resolved unless a text input allowing floating point numbers is the default.

          Show
          Robert Puffer added a comment - This issue would like to pretend to be trivial but in fact, is quite important due mostly to how often an instructor must workaround Moodle's default behavior. It is not resolved by "unlimited grades" which pertains only to the grading from the gradebook, not from the assignment, where uploaded files or online text are easily viewable in the grading context. Eric's assessment of the need is right-on... for me the issue cannot be considered resolved unless a text input allowing floating point numbers is the default.
          Hide
          Lesli Smith added a comment -

          I have to wholeheartedly agree with Bob, and i confess that I'm a little frustrated by my own inability to communicate what a stumbling block this has been to me in getting other teachers to adopt Moodle and drop their various auxiliary grade programs in favor of centralizing their entire learning management experience through Moodle.

          This issue has been near and dear to my heart since I started using Moodle. Like Bob, I've come up with dozens of workarounds in practice waiting for a better solution, but I guess the instructional side of the community is still having a hard time communicating to the development side what a major roadblock it is to adoption of the Moodle gradebook (in favor of dropping programs like Gradequick and housing everything in one place) when teachers find out they can't very simply assign any point value they want to about 75% of the activities in their courses.

          Maybe the javascript proposition isn't the greatest technical solution, but am I the only one running into major opposition in the field on this?

          I have looked into the unlimited grades option, but that just seems to unnecessarily complicate grade calculation setup in the gradebook--which we are trying to simplify to attract wider usage and adoption. But maybe I'm still not understanding how that works, like Eric, either.

          I can come up with the list of complications this issue creates if that would help.

          Show
          Lesli Smith added a comment - I have to wholeheartedly agree with Bob, and i confess that I'm a little frustrated by my own inability to communicate what a stumbling block this has been to me in getting other teachers to adopt Moodle and drop their various auxiliary grade programs in favor of centralizing their entire learning management experience through Moodle. This issue has been near and dear to my heart since I started using Moodle. Like Bob, I've come up with dozens of workarounds in practice waiting for a better solution, but I guess the instructional side of the community is still having a hard time communicating to the development side what a major roadblock it is to adoption of the Moodle gradebook (in favor of dropping programs like Gradequick and housing everything in one place) when teachers find out they can't very simply assign any point value they want to about 75% of the activities in their courses. Maybe the javascript proposition isn't the greatest technical solution, but am I the only one running into major opposition in the field on this? I have looked into the unlimited grades option, but that just seems to unnecessarily complicate grade calculation setup in the gradebook--which we are trying to simplify to attract wider usage and adoption. But maybe I'm still not understanding how that works, like Eric, either. I can come up with the list of complications this issue creates if that would help.
          Hide
          Eric Merrill added a comment -

          When you add a grade item in the gradebook, it already has a solution to this (you have a few text boxes, and two drop downs, and some js). The goal should be to take that existing interface, and bring it into the module grading setup, so it works and looks the same.

          I hope to work on this on this soon, but if somebody else is interested, have at it!

          Show
          Eric Merrill added a comment - When you add a grade item in the gradebook, it already has a solution to this (you have a few text boxes, and two drop downs, and some js). The goal should be to take that existing interface, and bring it into the module grading setup, so it works and looks the same. I hope to work on this on this soon, but if somebody else is interested, have at it!
          Hide
          Lesli Smith added a comment -

          Thanks so much, Eric. Any other creative solutions are very welcome.

          This last post is what I've landed on as the best probable solution, I guess, too. You are right.

          So basically, I would have students turn in their actual papers/projects in the advanced assignment with a "no grade" attached to it, but still be able to put their feedback there. And then I would enter a column in the gradebook for the desired point value so that grade calculations remain consistent with my desired point system. But this means the grade and the feedback are now disconnected when the student views them in the assignment feedback area.

          Another workaround I've tried is just simply breaking projects up into units that are smaller than 100 points, but this then makes for a super huge activity list in the gradebook.

          I think someone already covered the problem with setting up separate custom scales to get to your desired point value. This was probably the least successful workaround I tried.

          I really appreciate all you do. And nothing else compares to what you can do in other instructional areas, so the workarounds continue to be worthwhile, certainly.

          Show
          Lesli Smith added a comment - Thanks so much, Eric. Any other creative solutions are very welcome. This last post is what I've landed on as the best probable solution, I guess, too. You are right. So basically, I would have students turn in their actual papers/projects in the advanced assignment with a "no grade" attached to it, but still be able to put their feedback there. And then I would enter a column in the gradebook for the desired point value so that grade calculations remain consistent with my desired point system. But this means the grade and the feedback are now disconnected when the student views them in the assignment feedback area. Another workaround I've tried is just simply breaking projects up into units that are smaller than 100 points, but this then makes for a super huge activity list in the gradebook. I think someone already covered the problem with setting up separate custom scales to get to your desired point value. This was probably the least successful workaround I tried. I really appreciate all you do. And nothing else compares to what you can do in other instructional areas, so the workarounds continue to be worthwhile, certainly.
          Hide
          Eric Merrill added a comment -

          I guess I should clarify a bit more.

          My solution is only going to (easily) work for integer values. In fact, if I go into the DB and change the assignment to 150 points, the grading mechanism works already (you just get a dropdown for each student, with each possible integer grade, 0 to 150).

          I'm going to have to look more into the possibilities of floats, but that would be a lot more work, and a much bigger change to the system, so that seems less likely.

          Show
          Eric Merrill added a comment - I guess I should clarify a bit more. My solution is only going to (easily) work for integer values. In fact, if I go into the DB and change the assignment to 150 points, the grading mechanism works already (you just get a dropdown for each student, with each possible integer grade, 0 to 150). I'm going to have to look more into the possibilities of floats, but that would be a lot more work, and a much bigger change to the system, so that seems less likely.
          Hide
          Lesli Smith added a comment -

          Thanks, Eric. I understand the complexity, and I certainly understand why we should not simplify something in one place that creates a whole host of issues somewhere else (maybe behind the scenes in the code) that are otherwise unnecessary complications. So I'm still crossing my fingers for a new creative solution.

          Show
          Lesli Smith added a comment - Thanks, Eric. I understand the complexity, and I certainly understand why we should not simplify something in one place that creates a whole host of issues somewhere else (maybe behind the scenes in the code) that are otherwise unnecessary complications. So I'm still crossing my fingers for a new creative solution.
          Hide
          Robert Puffer added a comment -

          Eric, I assume you're familiar with the common hacks used on this issue. I'll include here in case anyone needs the quick fix:
          In lib/weblib.php function print_grade_menu(): set the value of $i=250 instead of 100 for the dropdown creation
          In lib/form/modform.php function onQuickFormEvent(): set the value of $i=250 instead of 100 for the dropdown creation

          Show
          Robert Puffer added a comment - Eric, I assume you're familiar with the common hacks used on this issue. I'll include here in case anyone needs the quick fix: In lib/weblib.php function print_grade_menu(): set the value of $i=250 instead of 100 for the dropdown creation In lib/form/modform.php function onQuickFormEvent(): set the value of $i=250 instead of 100 for the dropdown creation
          Hide
          Eric Merrill added a comment -

          Robert

          Ha - yeah... That's so... painful. And it still adds and arbitrary cap, when really one isn't needed. I feel that just using the method used by 'Add Grade Item' in the gradebook makes the most sense - and would be consistent, but I'm open to other suggestions.

          -eric

          Show
          Eric Merrill added a comment - Robert Ha - yeah... That's so... painful. And it still adds and arbitrary cap, when really one isn't needed. I feel that just using the method used by 'Add Grade Item' in the gradebook makes the most sense - and would be consistent, but I'm open to other suggestions. -eric
          Hide
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment -

          Probably the reason this got left so long is that 2.0 included major plans to make ALL the grading interfaces in modules actually be defined by an API in the core gradebook (a little like how groups work). Unfortunately this got pushed to 2.1 because of the other million new features. But a quick fix that doesn't change too much might be ok to solve the major annoyance here.

          And you're right about unlimitedgrades, my mistake.

          Show
          Martin Dougiamas added a comment - Probably the reason this got left so long is that 2.0 included major plans to make ALL the grading interfaces in modules actually be defined by an API in the core gradebook (a little like how groups work). Unfortunately this got pushed to 2.1 because of the other million new features. But a quick fix that doesn't change too much might be ok to solve the major annoyance here. And you're right about unlimitedgrades, my mistake.
          Hide
          Robert Puffer added a comment -

          w/patch: reluctant to step on toes but wanted to get to this fix... found time and found that the assignment coding wasn't over my head so I've put this together. all changes (20) made to lib.php functions (6) have included both patch and entire lib.php (1.9 latest stable). patch seems to apply cleanly to all copies of 1.9x I have around (lots). some notes:
          1. javascript is assumed for value validation though if not present it handles it gracefully
          2. including the line:
          $CFG->wipeassignmentoverrides=1;
          in config.php allows you to edit grades that have been overridden in the gradebook
          3. has worked as expected on all browsers I've tested, latest FF, Safari, Chrome (all for Mac and PC) and IE-8 in regular and compatibility mode.

          Show
          Robert Puffer added a comment - w/patch: reluctant to step on toes but wanted to get to this fix... found time and found that the assignment coding wasn't over my head so I've put this together. all changes (20) made to lib.php functions (6) have included both patch and entire lib.php (1.9 latest stable). patch seems to apply cleanly to all copies of 1.9x I have around (lots). some notes: 1. javascript is assumed for value validation though if not present it handles it gracefully 2. including the line: $CFG->wipeassignmentoverrides=1; in config.php allows you to edit grades that have been overridden in the gradebook 3. has worked as expected on all browsers I've tested, latest FF, Safari, Chrome (all for Mac and PC) and IE-8 in regular and compatibility mode.
          Hide
          Robert Puffer added a comment -

          Sorry... it was pointed out that I failed to make clear that the assignment grading interface changes alluded to above and included in the patch and mod/assignment/lib.php file DO ALLOW DECIMAL GRADE MARKING.

          Show
          Robert Puffer added a comment - Sorry... it was pointed out that I failed to make clear that the assignment grading interface changes alluded to above and included in the patch and mod/assignment/lib.php file DO ALLOW DECIMAL GRADE MARKING.
          Hide
          Chris Follin added a comment -

          Robert, thanks for the patch. Have you been using it on your site(s)?

          Has anyone else tried the patch?

          Show
          Chris Follin added a comment - Robert, thanks for the patch. Have you been using it on your site(s)? Has anyone else tried the patch?
          Hide
          Robert Puffer added a comment -

          The patch has been in production at our school for over a year. Its been a part of CLAMP's LAE for s half year where CLAMP schools have also put it into production.

          Show
          Robert Puffer added a comment - The patch has been in production at our school for over a year. Its been a part of CLAMP's LAE for s half year where CLAMP schools have also put it into production.
          Hide
          Chris Follin added a comment -

          Excellent. Thanks, Robert.

          Show
          Chris Follin added a comment - Excellent. Thanks, Robert.
          Hide
          Matt Long added a comment -

          Thanks for the hard work on this patch! We needed it because we have teaching assistants who do not have editing privileges in the course (making the gradebook less useful) but do need to input grades with decimals.
          I have a question about the patch. The first time you grade an assignment, the grade field has a default value of a minus sign . Is there a way to make this default a 0 or (better) blank? Teachers will have to delete the minus sign before they enter their grade, and if they just click in the box and type a grade, they'll end up entering a negative grade (which, I think, resolves to 0). Sorry if this is a bit trivial. Thanks again for making this available.

          Show
          Matt Long added a comment - Thanks for the hard work on this patch! We needed it because we have teaching assistants who do not have editing privileges in the course (making the gradebook less useful) but do need to input grades with decimals. I have a question about the patch. The first time you grade an assignment, the grade field has a default value of a minus sign . Is there a way to make this default a 0 or (better) blank? Teachers will have to delete the minus sign before they enter their grade, and if they just click in the box and type a grade, they'll end up entering a negative grade (which, I think, resolves to 0). Sorry if this is a bit trivial. Thanks again for making this available.
          Hide
          Robert Puffer added a comment -

          Matt, its interesting you bring this up because its been a point of discussion for the past couple days with "CLAMP":http:/clamp-it.org. We've determined and I'm mostly finished with the alterations necessary to make it a 'minus' sign rather than '-1'. Space or zero or any other positive number doesn't work without major rewrites to the assignment code. I'll try to keep it in mind to post an updated mod/assignment/lib.php file here – it would be based from Moodle 1.9.13. Otherwise my email is puffro01 at luther dot edu.

          Show
          Robert Puffer added a comment - Matt, its interesting you bring this up because its been a point of discussion for the past couple days with "CLAMP":http:/clamp-it.org. We've determined and I'm mostly finished with the alterations necessary to make it a 'minus' sign rather than '-1'. Space or zero or any other positive number doesn't work without major rewrites to the assignment code. I'll try to keep it in mind to post an updated mod/assignment/lib.php file here – it would be based from Moodle 1.9.13. Otherwise my email is puffro01 at luther dot edu.
          Hide
          Matthew Davidson added a comment -

          Any chance this patch would work for Moodle 2.x?

          Show
          Matthew Davidson added a comment - Any chance this patch would work for Moodle 2.x?
          Hide
          Michael de Raadt added a comment -

          This is now possible in the new assignment module.

          Show
          Michael de Raadt added a comment - This is now possible in the new assignment module.
          Hide
          Joshua Holden added a comment -

          Michael, do you mean the new 2.3 assignment module, or something that is going to be released with 2.5? I don't see how to do it in the 2.3 module. Maybe something needs to be turned on in our system? Can you point me at some documentation?

          Thanks!

          Show
          Joshua Holden added a comment - Michael, do you mean the new 2.3 assignment module, or something that is going to be released with 2.5? I don't see how to do it in the 2.3 module. Maybe something needs to be turned on in our system? Can you point me at some documentation? Thanks!
          Hide
          Lesli Smith added a comment -

          Right, so the part that is "fixed" is that we now have a field where we can enter 17.5 (B+) out of 20 where .5 capabilities are crucial to differences in percentages for grade distinctions. What I haven't yet seen is the ability to make a project assignment 125 points without still going the custom scale route. Some clarification on that for teachers might be helpful, here, as I think some of us were expecting both to be fixed by the same edit field capability revisions. I figured out I was wrong, but we are still hoping for that capability some day... Thanks!

          Show
          Lesli Smith added a comment - Right, so the part that is "fixed" is that we now have a field where we can enter 17.5 (B+) out of 20 where .5 capabilities are crucial to differences in percentages for grade distinctions. What I haven't yet seen is the ability to make a project assignment 125 points without still going the custom scale route. Some clarification on that for teachers might be helpful, here, as I think some of us were expecting both to be fixed by the same edit field capability revisions. I figured out I was wrong, but we are still hoping for that capability some day... Thanks!
          Hide
          Joshua Holden added a comment -

          Now I understand. I agree with Lesli.

          Show
          Joshua Holden added a comment - Now I understand. I agree with Lesli.

            People

            • Votes:
              40 Vote for this issue
              Watchers:
              18 Start watching this issue

              Dates

              • Created:
                Updated:
                Resolved: